I love trains. I have ridden just about every one that I could get to. Thousands of miles on Amtrak too. Even went to Promontory in 2019! I find your articles interesting and thought provoking.
As a native agrarian Californian I just can't seem to see the benefits of spending jillions of dollars on this project to "support" the well heeled. First it "might" run from Madera to Bakersfield. So, play it out, we're gonna ask the upper crust of Silicon Valley and Sacramento to take ACE or Amtrak for a couple of hours to Madera, cross a platform to zip to Bakersfield. Then what? Board a bus to LAUPT? A flight to LA is relatively cheap from any of the airports and takes about an hour to get to LAX, John Wayne, or any of the other airports in SoCal. Be honest and real, nobody is going to do that training exercise, except maybe me, once for the novelty of it. Then I would probably take the Coast Starlight back for fun. Even the illegals know that you can get from Madera to Bakersfield on less than a tank of gas... might take a little longer, but probably still cheaper even with CA gas prices. And, they can even get to Buttonwillow.
But, CA is also asking for Federal support. You complain about Musk, but yet this project is also really publicly funding a rich persons fantasy about travel. No matter how we throw around the Billion (1,000,000,000 - that's a lot of place holders) word, money is not cheap, basic economics dictate that when you have more of something it is worth less. Print excess money out of thin air, money is worth less (inflation). This is how the US debt is currently working. Spending needs to be curbed we cannot sustain the debt as it is. I am sure that people in Kelseyville, Weaverville, Alturas, Lahaina, HI, Chimney Rock, NC and Damascus, VA don't quite see it the same way as those in Megalopolis, CA. All that money that went to a corrupt foreign country, well maybe it could have been redirected to domestic things, maybe even HSR. I don't know, but these endless money pits need to be stopped.
If this were such a good idea, why hasn't private industry jumped on it? Just asking. I am just not so sure government funded rail transport is where it is at. The Transcontinental Railroads repaid their debt to the US, I don't see HSR doing that, just like BART or any other rail "agency" hasn't.
Thank you for your thoughtful comments. Nowhere on earth is passenger rail profitable. If profitability was the sole criteria for deciding whether to run passenger trains we wouldn't have them at all. So I think we need to consider social benefits such as economic development, reducing GHG emissions, etc., as well.
If I were running CAHSR I would have preferred to build out from LA and San Francisco (or San Jose) to someplace in the middle, such as Fresno, rather than build what critics are calling "a train to nowhere," i.e. Bakersfield - Merced. But I don't know whether that would have been practical given the huge costs and trouble raising money for construction.
I won't speculate on who will ride this train but I am sure the passengers will not be only the well-heeled.
The controversy over CAHSR reminds me of the criticism lobbed at New York Gov. DeWitt Clinton, who built the Erie Canal. They called it "Clinton's Ditch," but once it was completed New York gained a strong competitive advantage over neighboring states and went on to become an economic powerhouse, just as California is today.
If not for opposition from powerful special interests we would already have HSR in the United States, just like approximately 50 countries on four continents. If the new President is serious about making America great again, he would go all out to get the USA added to that list.
You write of the practicality or utility versus the money it is costing to build CAHSR in the state’s central and southern San Joaquin Valley sections. Even if only Madera-to-Shafter gets built on 119 miles of right-of-way, the project will still have utility. Worst-case scenario is it presumably will be used by Amtrak for state-supported “San Joaquin” trains. That’s 119 miles of shared track with the BNSF that “San Joaquin” trains will no longer have to share. Such a move will make operations on both sets of tracks more efficient. And, not just that, but the average speed of the affected Amtrak trains will presumably increase.
In the Bay Area, due to improved (faster) running times of Caltrain’s newest electric trains, ridership has seen an uptick. The same will presumably be the case here in the San Joaquin Valley once trains on the CAHSR line are open to the public to ride, regardless of whether those are CAHSR or Amtrak trains. So, the line, in that sense has definite utility.
Personally, I don’t see any reason why Musk would want to have anything to do with the California high-speed-rail project. He seems like the last person on Earth who would want to support it.
And, the $929 million that was confiscated from the high-speed rail project during the Trump administration, I’m under the impression that was returned to the project during the current administration. Something akin to the Trump administration withdrawing from the Paris Climate Accord only to have the U.S. rejoin it again during the current administration.
Furthermore, if the funds don’t materialize to complete the 171-mile-long Merced-Bakersfield segment (the high-end estimate being something like $36 billion), then the California High-Speed Rail Authority should focus on completing the 119 miles (known as the Initial Operating Segment) between Poplar Avenue in Shafter and Madera, and then if there is any money available to build further, the project should be extended to Merced, which is about 30 miles north of Madera. I say that because Valley Rail will extend all the way to Merced which will enable, through a cross-platform exchange, a passenger transfer from high-speed to conventional commuter trains at the Merced Station, and, by virtue of such transfer, passengers that way can continue their rail journeys to and from Modesto, Stockton, Lodi and Sacramento as well as to points in the Bay Area like Pleasanton and San Jose via Altamont Corridor Express (ACE) trains or connect with future Valley Link trains that will connect with BART at the Pleasanton/Dublin BART station there. So, there are all kinds of interesting possibilities. But the long and short of all of this is that the IOS needs to get completed. That’s the bottom line.
Yes, Elon Musk is a successful businessman -- just look at the demise of Twitter since he bought it. Space-X works because its underlying engineering was created by NASA. Tesla is "on the ropes" ever since Musk usurped the founders of the company and put his own "spin" on its development. It is interesting to note that these B.S. billionaires got their start with the billions that their fathers garnered. (I am not going to say "earned" as slaveholders didn't do the work of their operations.)
Yes 100% California High-Speed Rail in California.
Yes and yeah of course California High-Speed Rail in California.
I always want California High-Speed Rail in California and I always love California High-Speed Rail in California.
I love trains. I have ridden just about every one that I could get to. Thousands of miles on Amtrak too. Even went to Promontory in 2019! I find your articles interesting and thought provoking.
As a native agrarian Californian I just can't seem to see the benefits of spending jillions of dollars on this project to "support" the well heeled. First it "might" run from Madera to Bakersfield. So, play it out, we're gonna ask the upper crust of Silicon Valley and Sacramento to take ACE or Amtrak for a couple of hours to Madera, cross a platform to zip to Bakersfield. Then what? Board a bus to LAUPT? A flight to LA is relatively cheap from any of the airports and takes about an hour to get to LAX, John Wayne, or any of the other airports in SoCal. Be honest and real, nobody is going to do that training exercise, except maybe me, once for the novelty of it. Then I would probably take the Coast Starlight back for fun. Even the illegals know that you can get from Madera to Bakersfield on less than a tank of gas... might take a little longer, but probably still cheaper even with CA gas prices. And, they can even get to Buttonwillow.
But, CA is also asking for Federal support. You complain about Musk, but yet this project is also really publicly funding a rich persons fantasy about travel. No matter how we throw around the Billion (1,000,000,000 - that's a lot of place holders) word, money is not cheap, basic economics dictate that when you have more of something it is worth less. Print excess money out of thin air, money is worth less (inflation). This is how the US debt is currently working. Spending needs to be curbed we cannot sustain the debt as it is. I am sure that people in Kelseyville, Weaverville, Alturas, Lahaina, HI, Chimney Rock, NC and Damascus, VA don't quite see it the same way as those in Megalopolis, CA. All that money that went to a corrupt foreign country, well maybe it could have been redirected to domestic things, maybe even HSR. I don't know, but these endless money pits need to be stopped.
If this were such a good idea, why hasn't private industry jumped on it? Just asking. I am just not so sure government funded rail transport is where it is at. The Transcontinental Railroads repaid their debt to the US, I don't see HSR doing that, just like BART or any other rail "agency" hasn't.
Thank you for your thoughtful comments. Nowhere on earth is passenger rail profitable. If profitability was the sole criteria for deciding whether to run passenger trains we wouldn't have them at all. So I think we need to consider social benefits such as economic development, reducing GHG emissions, etc., as well.
If I were running CAHSR I would have preferred to build out from LA and San Francisco (or San Jose) to someplace in the middle, such as Fresno, rather than build what critics are calling "a train to nowhere," i.e. Bakersfield - Merced. But I don't know whether that would have been practical given the huge costs and trouble raising money for construction.
I won't speculate on who will ride this train but I am sure the passengers will not be only the well-heeled.
The controversy over CAHSR reminds me of the criticism lobbed at New York Gov. DeWitt Clinton, who built the Erie Canal. They called it "Clinton's Ditch," but once it was completed New York gained a strong competitive advantage over neighboring states and went on to become an economic powerhouse, just as California is today.
If not for opposition from powerful special interests we would already have HSR in the United States, just like approximately 50 countries on four continents. If the new President is serious about making America great again, he would go all out to get the USA added to that list.
You write of the practicality or utility versus the money it is costing to build CAHSR in the state’s central and southern San Joaquin Valley sections. Even if only Madera-to-Shafter gets built on 119 miles of right-of-way, the project will still have utility. Worst-case scenario is it presumably will be used by Amtrak for state-supported “San Joaquin” trains. That’s 119 miles of shared track with the BNSF that “San Joaquin” trains will no longer have to share. Such a move will make operations on both sets of tracks more efficient. And, not just that, but the average speed of the affected Amtrak trains will presumably increase.
In the Bay Area, due to improved (faster) running times of Caltrain’s newest electric trains, ridership has seen an uptick. The same will presumably be the case here in the San Joaquin Valley once trains on the CAHSR line are open to the public to ride, regardless of whether those are CAHSR or Amtrak trains. So, the line, in that sense has definite utility.
Personally, I don’t see any reason why Musk would want to have anything to do with the California high-speed-rail project. He seems like the last person on Earth who would want to support it.
And, the $929 million that was confiscated from the high-speed rail project during the Trump administration, I’m under the impression that was returned to the project during the current administration. Something akin to the Trump administration withdrawing from the Paris Climate Accord only to have the U.S. rejoin it again during the current administration.
Furthermore, if the funds don’t materialize to complete the 171-mile-long Merced-Bakersfield segment (the high-end estimate being something like $36 billion), then the California High-Speed Rail Authority should focus on completing the 119 miles (known as the Initial Operating Segment) between Poplar Avenue in Shafter and Madera, and then if there is any money available to build further, the project should be extended to Merced, which is about 30 miles north of Madera. I say that because Valley Rail will extend all the way to Merced which will enable, through a cross-platform exchange, a passenger transfer from high-speed to conventional commuter trains at the Merced Station, and, by virtue of such transfer, passengers that way can continue their rail journeys to and from Modesto, Stockton, Lodi and Sacramento as well as to points in the Bay Area like Pleasanton and San Jose via Altamont Corridor Express (ACE) trains or connect with future Valley Link trains that will connect with BART at the Pleasanton/Dublin BART station there. So, there are all kinds of interesting possibilities. But the long and short of all of this is that the IOS needs to get completed. That’s the bottom line.
There isn’t another state in the US that needs rail service more than California.
Yes, Elon Musk is a successful businessman -- just look at the demise of Twitter since he bought it. Space-X works because its underlying engineering was created by NASA. Tesla is "on the ropes" ever since Musk usurped the founders of the company and put his own "spin" on its development. It is interesting to note that these B.S. billionaires got their start with the billions that their fathers garnered. (I am not going to say "earned" as slaveholders didn't do the work of their operations.)